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« canadianstickdeath's Blog

This is something I should have made a long time ago. You know, back when I still made caves and it'd actually be useful to me. Anyway, I posted the link a little below, and I'd appreciate it if you all'd download it, play around with it, and tell me what you think. I don't want you guys to mention any potential new features just yet, I just want to know if you can find any bugs, or anything that doesn't function in the way that you would perhaps expect it to.

http://www.interguild.org/hatpc/cavemaker.zip (EDIT: You cannot trust this link to be remotely up-to-date.)
original link:
www.freewebs.com/cavehelp/cavemaker.zip

Due to a forum bug, you'll probably have to copy that and paste it into your address bar.

To run that, you'll first have to extract that all into the same folder. If you can't extract zip files, download WinRAR: http://www.win-rar.com/download.html

You'll also need to make sure you have the latest version of Java: http://www.java.com

Inside, there's a file named cavemaker.bat, which you will double-click on the run the program. A cmd window will pop up and hang around with you the whole time as you use the cavemaker. Close it, and you close the cavemaker with it, so, just ignore it for now. If it comes up and then just goes away, then you (probably) have not, either, followed these steps properly, or you do not have the latest version of java on your computer. I'm working on a way to make it stand-alone, but for now this will suffice. Also, you can make a short-cut of the .bat file (right-click create shortcut, probably) and then you can paste that into wherever you'd like to be able to open the cavemaker from. Also note that, since this was coded in java, it should be able to run on systems other than Windows. I haven't seen fungus in a while, but if you see him, direct him here so I can get that straightened out. We might have to jump through a few hoops, but it should be able to run on his mac. Update: The cavemaker program is now in a jar file. You should be able to run it by double clicking but, if not, set java as the default program from opening jar files. The .bat is still there if needed.

If you have Windows 7, check out this short topic for help: http://www.interguild.org/members/forums/topic.php?id=5124

A couple of warnings before using the program. I am not liable for any damages. I'm not saying damages will occur -- and I certainly hope they won't -- but if they do, please don't sue. Also, I'd suggest not using it on anything that you can't get back. Always make copies of your work, at least until we can verify that there are not any bugs preventing proper load-save and causing file-corruption.

I'm going to attempt to list some of the changes that I've made from the Neopets version. Here's what I could think of, in no particular order:

Spoiler: List of Changes from the Neopets Version

So yeah, try it out, and if there's anything that gets on your nerves, let me know I'll try making changes to it. I'll work on adding new features at an unspecified point in the future. For now, I'd like to ensure that this is working properly and there's nothing about it that people just hate to death.

Spoiler: Changes in Update 1


Spoiler: Changes in Update 2


Spoiler: Changes in Update 3


Spoiler: Changes in Update 4


Spoiler: Changes in Update 5


Spoiler: Changes in Update 6


Spoiler: Changes in Update 7


Spoiler: Changes in Update 8


Spoiler: Changes in Update 9 (Current Version)
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User Comments (543)
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canadianstickdeath
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Friday, February 8 2013, 12:08 pm EST

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You can actually just double-click run the .jar file now. But if that still doesn't work it's like, I'm sure your problem has been covered somewhere in this thread... The CMD window is probably giving you some sort of error, see if you can see what it says.
magnapple
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Wednesday, March 13 2013, 12:23 am EST

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Very nice, CSD
kinectking
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Saturday, April 6 2013, 11:42 am EST

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hai, im sorry to ask this, but i run the cavemaker on a mac, and i have never made a cave or even attempted to, and i am in serious need of some help. (>.> god i am about to sound like a complete moron but...) I know NOTHING about cave making, and i dont know how to do anything, (even the basics of placing terrain and stuff). I was really hoping someone could give me a link to EVERYthing, even the hardcore n00b basics, like, click to place terrain or whatever you do (see, I know absolutely nothing) Im sorry if this is the wrong place to ask this, but I really dont know ANYTHING.

EDIT: I have figured it out  


Spoiler:
shos
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Saturday, April 6 2013, 3:15 pm EST
~Jack of all trades~

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Good luck in learning this
in Mac it works like in other consoles - I've used the cavemaker in both windows and mac (at my last workplace lol)


canadianstickdeath
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Tuesday, April 15 2014, 6:22 pm EST

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Just making you guys aware of a bug so you don't lose any progress. Undo/Redo haven't been flagging the cave as modified, so you won't get asked if you're sure you want to save if that's the only thing you'd done since you last saved.

I fixed this and a couple other minor bugs but I will probably never update :p.
soccerboy13542
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Tuesday, April 15 2014, 6:34 pm EST
~*~Soccer~*~

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CSD was using CaveMaker....does this mean...A CAVE?!?!


Livio said:
You know, I was thinking of getting an internship at Microsoft, but I'm not sure I want their lameness to rub off on me.
canadianstickdeath
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Tuesday, April 15 2014, 7:07 pm EST

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I was reading over the code for no reason and noticed that it was missing :p.
soccerboy13542
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Tuesday, April 15 2014, 7:11 pm EST
~*~Soccer~*~

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Livio said:
You know, I was thinking of getting an internship at Microsoft, but I'm not sure I want their lameness to rub off on me.
canadianstickdeath
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Tuesday, April 15 2014, 7:45 pm EST

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Maybe I'll put out a bad smw hack... I'm one level away from finishing a world lol.
atvelonis
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Wednesday, April 16 2014, 12:25 pm EST
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There should be a HatPC level-name generator. The names would each be two words. An adjective, verb, or adverb as the first word in the title, and a noun as the second word of the title. (e.g. Sparkling Scarf; Cowardly Cherry; Adaptable Frogs, etc.) There could be an option to make each word start with the same letter for people if you want to use it in an alphabet series or something. Sounds good, right?

EDIT: Guys, I was kidding around... I would probably never use it if it existed. It seems like a ton of levels are in that format, though, that's why I said something about it.


jellsprout said:
As a kid I always thought tennisballs looked delicious and I liked biting them. I still remember the feel of the fuzz on my teeth and tongue.
Jorster
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Wednesday, April 16 2014, 12:50 pm EST
mfw

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You'd probably need to find a text file with a ridiculous amount of possible title words.


Bmwsu
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Wednesday, April 16 2014, 1:38 pm EST

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Or just use a title generator. Even if it doesn't give you exactly what you want, it might give you ideas.


canadianstickdeath
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Wednesday, May 20 2015, 1:53 pm EST

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Posting because I fixed an insanely minor bug in the Cavemaker but I still probably won't ever get around to uploading it. I used the wrong object's zoom level for updating the options menu as you switch between caves, so you might find that you're really at 75% zoom, but the menu says you're at 100%, for example. That's the full extent of the bug.
canadianstickdeath
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Sunday, September 24 2017, 4:58 am EST

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~ Update 9 ~

- I'm clearly not going to make some weird hybrid pirate/ice cavemaker, so I've decided to just leave them separate, but from now on they'll at least be zipped up together. Also, I moved the images inside the .jar files so that's one less folder floating around.
- Undo/Redo now flags the cave as modified.
- The zoom level in the options menu could sometimes display an incorrect level of zoom when switching between open caves.
- The Cavemaker mistakenly believed that Air Pockets could be cloned.
- Fixed an oversight where a clone in the top-left showed a shockwave error instead of terrain if Add Terrain Border is selected.
- Fixed bug where open/save wasn't defaulting to the caves folder at first.
- The words "terrain", "water", and "background" are actually not required to be spelled correctly by the game, so I decided to allow them to load. (Quick aside, in HATPC, invalid water types can sometimes function if used in a certain way, but I've opted not to support this. It's a quick manual edit if you need it.)
- K and V are now capitalized in the cave text, to increase compatibility with Neopets' Cavemaker. The first instance of L and G will also be capitalized from now on.
- Added Ctrl+0 shortcut for 100% zoom. Added a couple minor menu shortcuts you won't notice.
- Got rid of the 20-character limit for titles. (Uploader might complain if you go for it.)
- (HATPC Only) I got rid of some outdated code that put an apostrophe for your title in if you didn't put one in yourself. That trick stopped working ages ago. It defaults to "Untitled" from now on.
- I decided to move all of the enemies to the bottom of the tile list so that, when I add tutorial messages in HATPC, all of those Shockwave Error tiles won't get in the way as much. Applied that change to HATIC for no real reason.
- (HATPC Only) Added Tutorial Message capability.
-- That ugly level properties window is even worse now that there are 10 more textboxes in it. I decided to just let you save tutorial messages even if the cave isn't a tutorial.
-- There's a box where you can set how many tutorial messages your cave has. This was my way of telling the difference between having tutorial messages with nothing in them, and tutorial messages that crash the game. Who am I to tell you that shockwave errors that pop up if you get too close isn't legitimate gameplay? The textboxes will enable and disable based on that number. Any text in disabled boxes will be cleared if you hit OK. It defaults to 10 but if your cave isn't a tutorial and you don't bother to fill in any messages, the number will be ignored and taken as 0.
-- The tile select bar and the tiles in your cave update to reflect whether or not the title contains the string "tutorial" (case insensitive) and how many tutorial messages your cave is set to have. If you have messages configured, it'll write them into the tile selector so you don't have to constantly check which message is which.
-- To add tutorial messages to cavecode, you must put a ? at the start of any line. From then on, as long as the line for the tutorial message exists, you won't get a shockwave error. For the message itself, the first string of non-whitespace characters until the next whitespace on each line is removed (similar to what is done for the words "terrain", "background", and "water"), and what's left is trimmed of whitespace to become your tutorial message.
-- I mean I had to adjust a few more things to get the messages to work properly but it's not worth listing every minor thing.
- (HATIC Only) If a ? is encountered at the start of a line when loading a cave, all remaining text is ignored.
- Changes made to tutorial messages, but also the title, terrain type, and water type now go onto the undo stack and can be undone/redone.

---

Still at the usual link: http://cavehelp.webs.com/cavemaker.zip

Webs makes you pay to upload zip files now?? So I renamed it to .txt, uploaded it, and renamed it back to .zip, lol.

I made a lot of changes, particularly with loading and saving in this update, so please let me know if you run across any bugs.

Is there anybody out there that still prefers Cavemaker to CaveGen, at least for vanilla HATPC/HATIC? If you exist, I'd like to know about it.

I'm not planning on making major changes but if you have some suggestions, I'll at least read them.
Yaya
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Sunday, September 24 2017, 9:40 am EST

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Quote:
Is there anybody out there that still prefers Cavemaker to CaveGen, at least for vanilla HATPC/HATIC? If you exist, I'd like to know about it.


I do. I've tried to make regular HATPC levels in Cavegen before, but I've always either given up or used just it to make level templates. I could probably get more used to it if I used it as much as I have used your Cavemaker over the years, but at this point that's probably not going to happen. I have nothing against Cavegen, but it's hard to teach an old okapi new tricks. I'm pretty sure I'm using a fairly outdated version of your Cavemaker though. I'll have to check later



COMING SOON: A giant meteor. Please.
Give me +karma. Give me +karma.
jebby
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Sunday, September 24 2017, 10:26 am EST
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Quote:
I do. I've tried to make regular HATPC levels in Cavegen before, but I've always either given up or used just it to make level templates. I could probably get more used to it if I used it as much as I have used your Cavemaker over the years, but at this point that's probably not going to happen. I have nothing against Cavegen, but it's hard to teach an old okapi new tricks. I'm pretty sure I'm using a fairly outdated version of your Cavemaker though. I'll have to check later


Yaya, it'd be great to get some more insight into what feels unnatural when using CaveGen. And also things that you can't do in CaveGen, but can do in the Cavemaker. I've been trying to shrink that list down over the years. One thing that comes to mind is borderless caves. I've added many of the hotkeys, shortcuts and convenience tools to CaveGen that only Cavemaker previously had - maybe you'll discover something new if you revisit it. For example, the ability to easily insert and remove rows and columns.

I'm betting on the popularity of HATPCR and the tight integration with that game being the main reason for people to come back to CaveGen. For me, the workflow of uploading caves to vanilla HATPC is too much of a hassle - I'm very grateful for DroidFreak providing a means of improving that workflow. My goal with CaveGen has always been to make it easier for level-makers to build and test their HATPC levels.

I'm also grateful for CSD continuing to improve his own Cavemaker over the years - I remember it being a step above the original.
aych bee
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Sunday, September 24 2017, 2:08 pm EST
when i am king

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i never make caves but when i do i use CSD's cavemaker because i immensely Dislike working in the cloud


Spoiler:
canadianstickdeath
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Sunday, September 24 2017, 2:34 pm EST

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The workflow for HATIC isn't too bad once you've got it working, but vanilla HATPC's is pretty rough. Edit, View Map As Text, Copy, Close. Open fiddler. bpu... Open the .dcr. Click CoTW. Click on it in fiddler, break on response, text view, click in the box, ctrl+a, ctrl+v, run to completion. Wait for it to load. Every. Single. Time. The uploader has a few less steps but it's annoying having to work around that busted thing the whole time you're making the cave. Pick your poison I guess. I was thinking maybe, after HATPCR is done, I could make a version for it, but I'm not sure there's much point. I kind of doubt I'll be able to make the workflow as slick and by that time you'll all be used to cavegen for it anyway.

Please don't forget to try the newest version and make sure everything is working OK.
I can only test on my computer and I only tested everything a little :p.

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