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krotomo
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Thursday, December 12 2013, 9:34 pm EST
The Shepherd

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The Interguild has been noticeably becoming more inactive. However, we have many participating, creative, friendly members that go on every day, creating levels often, so what is causing it? I personally think that it has to do with the staff. Don't get me wrong, the admins and mods are all great people who have done their best, but as they get older they gain responsibility. They can't spend as much time on the Interguild. When the Interguild was first founded, it was run by people aged around 14 or 15 with plenty of free time. But now, the youngest admins are aged 20, and a majority of the staff members haven't made a level for several months. It's time to hand down the admin and mod powers to younger members who are willing to devote their time and effort into efficiently running and improving the site. If the only people with admin powers are older members who are simply too busy to actively participate in managing the site, then the Interguild will just die. Don't misinterpret what I'm trying to say, the staff has done a great job, but as they keep getting busier, people who have more free time need to take their place. We need new staff members, ones that are as just as excited about the Interguild as the founders from 2006.
soccerboy13542
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Thursday, December 12 2013, 9:36 pm EST
~*~Soccer~*~

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If you were given staff powers, what would you do?  


'Livio' said:
You know, I was thinking of getting an internship at Microsoft, but I'm not sure I want their lameness to rub off on me.
krotomo
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Thursday, December 12 2013, 9:37 pm EST
The Shepherd

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I don't necessarily think I should be admin, I just think that new ones need to be added. But if I was to become admin, these things are what I would do first:

-Update Featured Content, Site News and Events, and Great Levels, Videos, and More
-Return of Weekly Updates
-Images for recent videos
-New events
soccerboy13542
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Thursday, December 12 2013, 9:41 pm EST
~*~Soccer~*~

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I definitely think that featured content would be nice to have back. Weekly updates though.... someone would have to do them, plus not much goes on, or at least as of late.  


'Livio' said:
You know, I was thinking of getting an internship at Microsoft, but I'm not sure I want their lameness to rub off on me.
krotomo
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Thursday, December 12 2013, 9:47 pm EST
The Shepherd

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Hopefully enough activity can be sparked so that Weekly Updates will really serve a purpose, but the Featured Content has always been depressing because it makes me feel like the Interguild is really dying out.
soccerboy13542
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Thursday, December 12 2013, 9:59 pm EST
~*~Soccer~*~

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yeah, makes me feel the same way. it possibly could be due to people no longer taking the time to play levels.


'Livio' said:
You know, I was thinking of getting an internship at Microsoft, but I'm not sure I want their lameness to rub off on me.
atvelonis
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Thursday, December 12 2013, 10:33 pm EST
Apocryphal Ruminator

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'soccerboy13542' said:
I definitely think that featured content would be nice to have back. Weekly updates though.... someone would have to do them, plus not much goes on, or at least as of late.  

Maybe the new Staff Members would write the Weekly Updates, I dunno. I remember Yimmy was writing Weekly Updates for a while a couple of months ago, but he stopped, probably because he got bored or didn't feel like writing them anymore. There wasn't even much to talk about unfortunately, so the updates sadly were mostly links to the occasional post that got some Karma and maybe a level or video once in a blue moon. Speaking of Weekly Updates, someone should write one, just for the heck of it. Well, also because Tuesday was INTERNATIONEEZLE DAY, which is obviously the most spectacular holiday in all the world.

'krotomo' said:
It's time to hand down the admin and mod powers to younger members who are willing to devote their time and effort into efficiently running and improving the site.

Also when you say, "Hand down the Admin and Mod powers", do you mean 'out with the old, in with the new' or are you suggesting that we add another Staff Member to the list?

'soccerboy13542' said:
yeah, makes me feel the same way. it possibly could be due to people no longer taking the time to play levels.

I think the site has a decent amount of activity, just people have to make the effort to play levels and make posts and such more often. We shouldn't have to force ourselves to watch the new walkthrough or play the new level or whatever, just I think it would be fine to take a few minutes out of the many we have in a day to look at topics we wouldn't normally have looked at. Perhaps we will find something interesting that, prior to this newfound discovery, we wouldn't have even glanced at.

'krotomo' said:
I don't necessarily think I should be admin,

And regarding new Staff Members, I personally can't think of anyone except for 2 or 3 (No names here) regular members that would be fit to be Mods or Admins. Half of us have biased views of everything, and the other half are irresponsible and silly all of the time, (Myself included. I would be a dreadful Staff Member.) save for the couple of users who might actually do well. And they're not even all that active, so now were just back to square one. Solution: wait for Livio to get out of College and everything should be back to normal. Granted, that won't be for a while, so well have to make do for the time being.

'krotomo' said:
I just think that new ones need to be added.

And if we had more Staff Members, what would happens to the users who didn't make it onto the "next platform"? (Lol terrible HatPC references yeah) Considering that 1/3 to 1/4 of the active members are Staff Members, if some more members got promoted, even if it was just like 3 people, that would leave the now-smaller group of regular people behind and in the dark. If too many people become Staff Members, the Interguild could split into 2 factions: Staff Members and non-Staff Members. If the so-called factions were to have an equal amount if members then we would get nothing done because we would not be able to decide on anything. I guess that means the only option would be to throw out the inactive Staff Members and bring in the new ones. That seems a bit... Meh. I seriously doubt that the Staff Members getting booted out would be too happy about their demotion. What if they eventually returned to the Interguild after a break, just to find out that their position had been given to someone else without their knowledge? They might have wanted to post new levels, videos, etc., but after their shocking discovery they might not feel so inclined to do so. Just saying, there isn't really any way out of the situation we've gotten ourselves into. The only thing we can do is to be more active ourselves. Turning people into Staff Members definitely puts some pressure onto whomever is making the transition's shoulders, which is essentially just forcing them to be more active: If they aren't active, they will be demoted. We don't want he site to turn into something like that, now, do we?


'jellsprout' said:
As a kid I always thought tennisballs looked delicious and I liked biting them. I still remember the feel of the fuzz on my teeth and tongue.
soccerboy13542
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Thursday, December 12 2013, 10:41 pm EST
~*~Soccer~*~

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I think I could do something simple as staff member such as putting up Preview Images or Featured Content. Doesn't seem too hard though I may be missing something.


'Livio' said:
You know, I was thinking of getting an internship at Microsoft, but I'm not sure I want their lameness to rub off on me.
krotomo
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Thursday, December 12 2013, 11:01 pm EST
The Shepherd

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@atvelonis

If a person isn't active and devoted to being an admin, why should they stay one? If there can only be so many staff members, then taking those spots up with people who aren't really contributing is just hurting the site. It's not like being an admin is their lifeline or anything, and they'll still stay as well respected members of the Interguild. However, why demote staff members at all? I still don't understand the problem with just adding new ones without removing ones from the list we already have. All we need is 1 or 2 to manage all of the recent inactivity and that'll be all. The Interguild will not just split up into 2 factions, we are a close, tight community, not a country where a person will only ever end up meeting an incredibly small portion of the citizens.
soccerboy13542
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Thursday, December 12 2013, 11:09 pm EST
~*~Soccer~*~

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Things like uploading videos, getting pictures for videos, putting them in featured content are nice. Uploading videos gets done pretty quickly, within 24 hours, but the video previews still have ones left from August to be done. In fact, that entire newest video page needs to be done... though not essential, it looks better.  


'Livio' said:
You know, I was thinking of getting an internship at Microsoft, but I'm not sure I want their lameness to rub off on me.
Yaya
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Thursday, December 12 2013, 11:48 pm EST

Age: 28
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Update Featured Content, Site News and Events, and Great Levels, Videos, and More: I think we can all agree on this. It doesn't need to get updated at a rapid pace, but still, Soccerboy, Quirvy/Harumbai, Sefro, and CSD have all released level(s) that have not shown up there. Not to diss other people's levels, but usually when people who are known for levels of consistent great quality make something, I think should be noteworthy enough to get in there. CSD's level is just an example of a glitch, but the fact that CSD made a level is front page worthy, lol.

Return of Weekly Updates: No. Nothing happens. This can't entirely be blamed on the staff. Non-staff members are free to submit their own, yet few still do, because nobody wants to take the time/they realize that little is going on and there are few members who would benefit from them. Most people who are active to read "weekly updates" were there for the events featured in it. If anything, I'd suggest a quarterly update/newsletter, written by an actual staff member. Four months gives plenty of time for things to happen, but they would only have to cover the important stuff in that time. And it would actually be helpful to members who are inactive for a period of time by summarizing what happened while they were gone with broad strokes.

Images for recent videos: This has always been a problem, its not come up all of the sudden. Does it really make a difference? Besides maybe irritating a few people by it's lack of presence, a video image is just for appearances, and there's not much you can express about a video with that tiny image. Sure, it's nice to see video images updated, but it's not necessary for the site to function.

New events: Comps? No one will enter them. Not even the non-staff make levels that often. You've seen how all these non-staff initiated comps go down, either there's no entries or just a few, and the maturity of the members that often run them do not give me the hope that they would be judged fairly/followed through with. And I know this isn't always the case, but levels turn out better when they aren't made with a specific theme in mind/time constraints, lots of comp entries were begun before comps started and just happened to fit the theme. Mafia games? We all hate each other. I figure I at least wait until next summer before I tap the Interguild to see if they're ready to get down and scummy again. Anyone else is free to run one until then, but I have my doubts as to its success.

'krotomo' said:
Hopefully enough activity can be sparked so that Weekly Updates will really serve a purpose, but the Featured Content has always been depressing because it makes me feel like the Interguild is really dying out.
How do you suggest to spark activity? The site isn't dead because it's bad or the staff is inefficient, it's because people are busy IRL. That won't change no matter what we do to the site. Things like Minecraft have helped bring in more members, but most of them know other members IRL. A site centered around HATPC is pretty niche to begin with. Sure, we host other games, but so do more popular sites. Getting a member like Yimmy nowadays was sheer luck. I think this is the best we can hope for until significant changes come to the core/focus of the site.

'krotomo' said:
However, why demote staff members at all? I still don't understand the problem with just adding new ones without removing ones from the list we already have. All we need is 1 or 2 to manage all of the recent inactivity and that'll be all. The Interguild will not just split up into 2 factions, we are a close, tight community, not a country where a person will only ever end up meeting an incredibly small portion of the citizens.
No, the Interguild will not split up into two factions, but it will get to where half of the active members are staff. Most staff have been on within the past week, I still consider that active. There's no point to having any more. And where members with the ideal time requirements are, they probably don't have the maturity to be a staff member. It's definitely a good idea to have the staff be a few years older than most on the non staff, it allows every thing to be carried out with a clear head, and that's how the world works most of the time anyway.

Yes, the Interguild is dying. Get over it. I guess I understand your frustration or even fears, but I hope you realize it's not because of inactive staff, and fixing that will not change the inactivity. Thankfully, it is a slow death. We'll probably never get to the point where we all  stop coming on, we'll just stop getting new members, which seems to be the case right now anyway. Hopefully there's some state of the Interguild by Livio or whatever around the new year where these concerns can be addressed, but most of the ideas laid out in those are just ideas and not followed through with. Things come and go. Enjoy them while they last.



COMING SOON: A giant meteor. Please.
Give me +karma. Give me +karma.
krotomo
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Friday, December 13 2013, 8:04 am EST
The Shepherd

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'Yaya' said:
New events: Comps? No one will enter them. Not even the non-staff make levels that often.
No, not the usual Comps. The whole point of having new admins is so that they can think of brand new, creative ideas to bring back activity and will also have the power to actually put them in place.

'Yaya' said:
The site isn't dead because it's bad or the staff is inefficient, it's because people are busy IRL. That won't change no matter what we do to the site. Things like Minecraft have helped bring in more members, but most of them know other members IRL. A site centered around HATPC is pretty niche to begin with.
It's not that everyone is busy IRL, it's that the staff is busy IRL. I'm not trying to say that the staff is inefficient, I'm saying that they're simply too busy to run the site because they don't have enough free time to come up with new ideas and improvements. There are many members on here that have plenty of free time, (mainly because they're younger), and could be placed as admins. The original founders were 14-year-olds, why can't a few admins be too? Probably one of the main reasons new people don't come is because all they see is a boring, unchanging website with nothing but a few people talking once in a while and a front page that never gets updated. New admins who have plenty of free time will likely help fix this dead site. Even if they don't, it's ridiculous not to try.

'Yaya' said:
No, the Interguild will not split up into two factions, but it will get to where half of the active members are staff. Most staff have been on within the past week, I still consider that active. There's no point to having any more. And where members with the ideal time requirements are, they probably don't have the maturity to be a staff member. It's definitely a good idea to have the staff be a few years older than most on the non staff, it allows every thing to be carried out with a clear head, and that's how the world works most of the time anyway.
Staff coming online isn't being active. Opening a website for 5 seconds isn't active at all. Even posting still isn't major activity. Many of them simply don't make levels, videos, or really participate in anything important about the site at the moment. Of the 15 newest videos, 2 of them were made by admins. Of the 45 newest levels, 4 of them were made by admins. If the staff did make up a large portion of the "active" community (which it can, if you have that loose definition of active), then you should be seeing a lot more levels made by staff members. Whether they're too busy IRL, or they've simply lost interest, we can't have inactive, or at least the most inactive of the active, be the only ones running the site. Despite your idea of active, there really are only a couple staff members who are truly active.

jebby
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Friday, December 13 2013, 10:21 am EST
Interguild Founder

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'Yaya' said:
Yes, the Interguild is dying. Get over it. I guess I understand your frustration or even fears, but I hope you realize it's not because of inactive staff, and fixing that will not change the inactivity. Thankfully, it is a slow death. We'll probably never get to the point where we all  stop coming on, we'll just stop getting new members, which seems to be the case right now anyway. Hopefully there's some state of the Interguild by Livio or whatever around the new year where these concerns can be addressed, but most of the ideas laid out in those are just ideas and not followed through with. Things come and go. Enjoy them while they last.


I feel the need to respond to this. The interguild has never been a community with lots of members, nor has it ever been a hive of activity. However, the members that are active are consistently active enough to keep it going - the site has always cycled between near-death and moderate activity. And I'd say that it's doing okay at the moment - I've seen it in much worse shape. There's been a bunch of walkthrough vids lately and the random chat thread always seems to have new posts. So no, I disagree about the interguild dying. I've thought it's died on a number of occasions in the past and it never has. It just goes into hibernation mode every now and then.

But I do agree that we need some fresh staff - the site needs some active staff to keep things up-to-date and encourage activity. It's promising that a number of you have posted ideas on this thread on how to improve the running of the site. I'll raise the point with the other staff to see if some of you can get morphed into admins.  
Yimmy
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Friday, December 13 2013, 11:00 am EST
Resident Goody two-shoes

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DON'T MAKE ME STAFF! you've seen all the havoc i've caused. that would be almost as bad as making neezles staff. i've always thought soccer would be a good staff member, because... how do i say this?... he's the nicest non-staff member. i'm not saying that everyone else is jerks, it's just that soccer is the nicest. binary jory dar and thom are eliminated for obvious reasons. I do want more levels, but I just... don't enjoy making levels. Likewise, i want to play the levels, but half of them are to hard. I WANT to help this site, it's just that i can't really.  


Spoiler:

Interguild discord!! People use it!!
kinectking
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Friday, December 13 2013, 11:29 am EST

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'yimmy7' said:
I do want more levels, but I just... don't enjoy making levels. Likewise, i want to play the levels, but half of them are to hard. I WANT to help this site, it's just that i can't really.  

I definitely know this struggle. I enjoy hatPC but I am not particularly good at hatPC, so while I enjoy playing levels, I feel like my opinion is misguiding, because if I rate a level a 4.6/5 difficulty, and everyone else rates it a 2.5/5, then I am basically raising the difficulty rating, from the view point of a novice user, and if I rate it 2.5/5 difficulty, then it would appear I am better than I am, and will thus be expected to live up to that reputation, thus causing a chain reaction of misguiding level difficulty rate. To sum things up, you are right yimmy, this is a problem, so, like you, I would like to help the site, but I don't know how


Spoiler:
Yaya
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Friday, December 13 2013, 12:06 pm EST

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'jebby' said:
I feel the need to respond to this. The interguild has never been a community with lots of members, nor has it ever been a hive of activity. However, the members that are active are consistently active enough to keep it going - the site has always cycled between near-death and moderate activity. And I'd say that it's doing okay at the moment - I've seen it in much worse shape. There's been a bunch of walkthrough vids lately and the random chat thread always seems to have new posts. So no, I disagree about the interguild dying. I've thought it's died on a number of occasions in the past and it never has. It just goes into hibernation mode every now and then.

But I do agree that we need some fresh staff - the site needs some active staff to keep things up-to-date and encourage activity. It's promising that a number of you have posted ideas on this thread on how to improve the running of the site. I'll raise the point with the other staff to see if some of you can get morphed into admins.  
I guess the first part of my paragraph was a little harsh, I think I got a little too into it, lol. I do think the amount of new members we get that contribute to the site though has became a really slow crawl. Excluding MapGameBot, Yimmy/his sister, and Neezles' spam accounts (which I'm not sure exactly how many of those are there), none of the recent new members have made any new levels. Usually, it was always the newer members that continually and eagerly pumped out new content. Unless they're all friends of friends who want to play Minecraft, I'm a little confused as to what they joined for. I'm pretty sure there's nothing important on the Interguild like how to get HATPC to work that requires you to make an account in order to see it. Keep in mind I don't know how many of the recent accounts are spam, but it still seems pretty empty in that field. I guess the Interguild does go through waxing and waning periods, but the frusturating thing is when we are active, it's never new people, it's just the regulars showing up more often.



COMING SOON: A giant meteor. Please.
Give me +karma. Give me +karma.
soccerboy13542
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Friday, December 13 2013, 6:11 pm EST
~*~Soccer~*~

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Kinectking, rate levels whatever you feel like (within reason). People are open to suggestions, and if something is too hard of mine, I'll tone it down. I've been trying to tone down difficulty in my past levels.


'Livio' said:
You know, I was thinking of getting an internship at Microsoft, but I'm not sure I want their lameness to rub off on me.
Yimmy
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Friday, December 13 2013, 6:36 pm EST
Resident Goody two-shoes

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if i don't rate it, it's to hard for me to beat ;d


Spoiler:

Interguild discord!! People use it!!
Teo
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Friday, December 13 2013, 6:59 pm EST

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'yimmy7' said:
;d
Hey that's my own emoticon!

I don't think new staff is needed, and even if it would get considered, there's still a possibility the new staff members won't have time everytime they're needed. I think it's good as it is, because if there are weekly updates needed, someone that's good in english can write them and the staff members that aren't too active but still visit the site all the time can publish it and give credit. I personally think it's much less work than selecting new staff and then hoping for more activity. Right now everyone can help creating needed articles and essential updates for the site and the staff-only things required for putting those things to the site may be done by them. If we choose maybe 2 or 3 new staff members, the rest of people who wanted to participate won't be needed for anything anymore even though their help would be valuable for the community. Still, this idea is worth considering but we need to keep in mind we always have fresh and active members willing to help the site with no difference if they are staff or not.
Bmwsu
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Friday, December 13 2013, 7:04 pm EST

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I like this idea that Krotomo has of bringing in new minds to try and keep things fresh and repopulate the place with new ideas.  Sure we still need old, seasoned veterans so it chaos when something goes down (This much is obvious and we all can agree), but a new perspective would help see things in a new and different light.

Of course, if we do get new staff members then I think that one or two inactive ones should get laid off.  I don’t know if they really are active, but if they are they’re active only in the staff chat.  With a list that would grow, it would only unbalance the ratio of staff/non-staff, and as such, to preserve a decent balance and to show that we care about activity and keeping the site up to date, someone(s) would have to go.  Now, if a person goes onto a site and sees that a staff member hasn’t been active they might just assume that they’ve had other stuff happen and will be back, but if they join and then see that they are still gone for a long time without public explanation, then it might make them question the ability of the community to realize when they need to do something.  It might make them think that the community is too slow to act and slow in their decisions.  That may seem like a weak argument, but it’s what I believe.

I think that this whole idea of how new members need to make levels and that’s what is considered new activity is false and a leech to progressing forward.  The idea of how we have a level database of dozens of flash games and a few downloadable games where you can post levels and videos and comment and get comment on is a great, but there comes a point when you have to admit that it’s decreasing in popularity.  I loved playing flash games when I was younger and that’s what I did almost the entire day when I could.  I joined the Interguild because I wanted to show off what I did and have other people like my levels (Then again, I was a stupid… 12 year old, I think, when I joined and I made crap levels, but I digress).  I think that we have to realize that we’ve all grown up and have moved onto bigger, fancier games.  The youth has moved to the next Call of Duty and the next console and if we want to attract them then we need to move with them.  It’s been said and I’ll say it again: we are a niche site.  I say it’s time to move away from that and try to broaden our scope.
The multilevel database was a step towards that.  We were just HatPC-centered before it.  Why can’t we do that now?
Of course, you might say that because we need to move with people we’ll move away from people like our own members.  While that might be true, not everybody who comes onto this site comes for the games now.  They come for the people that they’ve known for years now.  I don’t think that bringing in new stuff will change the way that people feel towards the others nor will it change whether or not they decide to come on (Or if it does, not much at all)... inb4 “you’re wrong”.

Edit: Teo also brings up a good point that we need to keep in mind that no matter who is or isn't staff we can still improve the site.  Just not as easily, probably.


soccerboy13542
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Friday, December 13 2013, 7:08 pm EST
~*~Soccer~*~

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What if this is all a giant conspiracy? The Interguild is 10x more active than it appears because all the interesting posts go into the staff forums.


'Livio' said:
You know, I was thinking of getting an internship at Microsoft, but I'm not sure I want their lameness to rub off on me.
Bmwsu
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Friday, December 13 2013, 7:10 pm EST

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What if this is a site that's not the Interguild, but it has a façade to us believe we are?


soccerboy13542
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Friday, December 13 2013, 7:15 pm EST
~*~Soccer~*~

Karma: 450
Posts: 4466
Gender: Male
Location: 1945
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Then we are all fools....


'Livio' said:
You know, I was thinking of getting an internship at Microsoft, but I'm not sure I want their lameness to rub off on me.

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