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jebby
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Saturday, January 14 2017, 3:36 pm EST
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A few changes made today based on your feedback:
- Improved zooming! The grid no longer wobbles around when zooming into large caves and centres the cave when zooming out.
- HATPC Reborn now opens in a new tab rather than a popup window.
- Palette tiles have tooltips and are grouped into categories to make them a little more understandable for new players.
- Insert and Delete keys work as in previous cavemakers.
- The clipboard icon on the Copy button is now 53% more clipboardy and has a tooltip for those who weren't sure what it did.
- Grey squares are replaced by the actual terrain texture on the grid. This does impact performance on large caves - I may add a high performance option some time in the future.
soccerboy13542
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Saturday, January 14 2017, 7:10 pm EST
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I'm not sure if other people used this feature, but having hotkeys for tiles could be helpful. In CSD's cavemaker i exclusively use Alt + key to place things.


'Livio' said:
You know, I was thinking of getting an internship at Microsoft, but I'm not sure I want their lameness to rub off on me.
jebby
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Sunday, January 15 2017, 7:35 am EST
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It just shows how much of a casual user I always was of the cavemaker - I never even touched the hotkeys. No excuse not to know about them though.

CaveGen has hotkeys for selecting tiles and there is a key (Insert) for placing the current tile, but there are no hotkeys for placing tiles without selecting them. Fascinating how many different ways there are of placing tiles. The closest approximation of your existing workflow for say, boulders, would be:
- Press 'o'
- Press 'Insert' wherever you want to place boulders at the cursor

However, I'm aware that at least 2 people are used to the Alt insertion method. For this reason, I will add the Alt insertion keys as another alternative placement method. This will also need to be accompanied by arrow key navigation of the caves. It's on my short-term to-do list.

Livio gave me some useful feedback in a similar vein. He said that he wanted keyboard shortcuts, meaning that CaveGen completely fails to explain to the user that it actually does has shortcuts, just slightly different to the ones that people are used to. He also said that he would like to know which tile is selected from the palette. I'll solve these, at least partially, by labelling the tile tooltips with the hotkeys and highlighting the selected palette tile.

Livio also made an interesting point that he didn't know whether his cave was being saved. In his attempts to save his cave, he ended up rebuilding it and losing his progress (this can be fixed with an "Are you sure?" type dialog). The reality is that CaveGen saves automatically like Google Docs.

I perhaps listened too much to the people at my job who tell me that manual saving is dead and that automatic saving is the future. Perhaps it is, but I shouldn't be saving silently. I will add some subtle means of notifying the user that their changes have been saved.

Thanks again for this kind of feedback. I wouldn't know about these problems without it. My goal is to use these incremental improvements to make an awesome cavemaker.
Yaya
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Sunday, January 15 2017, 10:26 pm EST

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Would it be possible to make it so hitting the play button closes previous HATPC Reborn tabs that were generated from the play button?



COMING SOON: A giant meteor. Please.
Give me +karma. Give me +karma.
DroidFreak36
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Monday, January 16 2017, 2:48 pm EST
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Quote:
Would it be possible to make it so hitting the play button closes previous HATPC Reborn tabs that were generated from the play button?

No. It wouldn't be possible. A webpage can't make your browser close other tabs.




Quote:
Rictory for Ralkyon!

HATPC Reborn home page
Yaya
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Monday, January 16 2017, 3:03 pm EST

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Okay, I wasn't positive. It's not that big of an inconvenience



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jebby
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Monday, January 16 2017, 3:36 pm EST
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Quote:
No. It wouldn't be possible. A webpage can't make your browser close other tabs.


It can... if it created that tab and the webpage it was visiting was from the same origin. If those conditions are satisfied, you can also refresh tabs as well. So, while CaveGen and HATPC Reborn are on different domains, this will always be a limitation. Of course, the ideal would be having HATPC Reborn run in the same tab, replacing the level editor grid in a seamless transition. Given that me and Droid currently take separate ownership of the two projects, that won't be the case any time soon. It's the best we can come up with for now.
aych bee
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Monday, January 16 2017, 9:02 pm EST
when i am king

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wow now we are stepping into some hacker territory this is gettin DANGEROUS


Spoiler:
canadianstickdeath
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Tuesday, January 17 2017, 4:36 pm EST

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It REALLY wants me to make an account. I probably won't. :/
jebby
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Tuesday, January 17 2017, 4:43 pm EST
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That's a shame. If you're uncomfortable with using a Facebook or Google account, there is the option to sign up with just your email like you did for this site. Unfortunately, security (and the possibility of a variety of interesting features down the line) is rather difficult without authentication.
jebby
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Saturday, January 21 2017, 7:17 pm EST
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Hotkey guide added. A lot of the old cavemaker hotkeys have been added with it, including means of moving the cursor, panning, zooming, inserting and deleting without needing the mouse.
DroidFreak36
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Saturday, January 21 2017, 7:43 pm EST
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Uh, I can't edit the cave size in the properties. Or the cave name. Issue occurs on both firefox and chrome.




Quote:
Rictory for Ralkyon!

HATPC Reborn home page
jebby
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Saturday, January 21 2017, 7:45 pm EST
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Fix is being deployed and should be live in a minute or two. Was a result of me rewriting the keyboard handler. Thanks for letting me know!

Anyway... hotkey guide has been added
aych bee
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Sunday, January 22 2017, 12:16 am EST
when i am king

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Jebby if you add the option to edit other people's caves then I will sell you my soul. I reserve the right to infringe on copyright :/


Spoiler:
shos
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Wednesday, January 25 2017, 5:19 pm EST
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I've been eager to try this today and yesterday but I remembered that my mouse is horrible and I can't do dangz.
So, I'll get myself a new mouse and get it done.

From the poor attempt at it today (with the ladders and all), this looks pretty neat. in depth response to come later this week!


jebby
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Thursday, January 26 2017, 6:20 pm EST
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Quote:
I've been eager to try this today and yesterday but I remembered that my mouse is horrible and I can't do dangz.
So, I'll get myself a new mouse and get it done.

From the poor attempt at it today (with the ladders and all), this looks pretty neat. in depth response to come later this week!


Note that you can now use CaveGen almost entirely without a mouse if you want - check out the hotkey guide on the site. You can do stuff like zooming, panning and movement without the mouse. That said, I personally prefer building caves with a mouse - maybe you're the same.
Sefro
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Friday, January 27 2017, 3:35 pm EST

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Minor bug:  if you use ctrl-z to undo then it also selects the secret area tile (hotkey z).
krotomo
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Monday, January 30 2017, 6:30 pm EST
The Shepherd

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Is there any way to change the dimensions of a cave without rebuilding the whole thing? I pretty much always start with a larger grid than I actually need, then shrink the cave when it's done.

EDIT: Nevermind, you said in the original post you're working on row and column insertion/deletion
DroidFreak36
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Monday, January 30 2017, 6:38 pm EST
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Yeah, a good resizing mechanic would be an important feature to add. Steel City ended up with a bunch of extra space on the bottom because I couldn't shrink it in CaveGen. Not that that is a big issue itself, but there are also cases where an author wants to add extra layers to a cave, and it's virtually impossible to do that as-is. A workaround would be to add the ability to paste in level codes, because then users could copy a level out, change the size, and then paste it back in.




Quote:
Rictory for Ralkyon!

HATPC Reborn home page
shos
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Wednesday, February 1 2017, 5:20 pm EST
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So, this definitely needs an option to load a cave from text, like, paste into a textbox and hit "load" and you'll start editting it.


shos
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Wednesday, February 1 2017, 5:36 pm EST
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also zoom out doesn't work for me for a small cave?


jebby
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Wednesday, February 1 2017, 5:52 pm EST
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Quote:
Minor bug:  if you use ctrl-z to undo then it also selects the secret area tile (hotkey z).


Well spotted. I need to block out tile selection on those commands and also when typing in inputs.

Quote:
Is there any way to change the dimensions of a cave without rebuilding the whole thing? I pretty much always start with a larger grid than I actually need, then shrink the cave when it's done.


This is now a really high priority for me, given the demand for it. I'm working on it.

Quote:
Yeah, a good resizing mechanic would be an important feature to add. Steel City ended up with a bunch of extra space on the bottom because I couldn't shrink it in CaveGen. Not that that is a big issue itself, but there are also cases where an author wants to add extra layers to a cave, and it's virtually impossible to do that as-is. A workaround would be to add the ability to paste in level codes, because then users could copy a level out, change the size, and then paste it back in.


Quote:
So, this definitely needs an option to load a cave from text, like, paste into a textbox and hit "load" and you'll start editting it.


Level pasting is on the agenda, though maybe not before column/row insertion/deletion and event support.

Quote:
also zoom out doesn't work for me for a small cave?


This is actually a really useful catch - I wouldn't have spotted this otherwise. For me, centring on zoom out doesn't work on tiny caves like 10x10 - was zoom centring the issue you had too? For now, you can centre using the pan keys.

If you want live updates on the work I'm doing, you can subscribe to the Trello board I've been using: https://trello.com/b/OwoCo7jc/cavegen
DroidFreak36
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Wednesday, February 1 2017, 10:49 pm EST
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What are the pan keys? They aren't arrow keys, because those move your brush around the level.




Quote:
Rictory for Ralkyon!

HATPC Reborn home page
jebby
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Thursday, February 2 2017, 2:28 am EST
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Alt + arrows. Take a look at the hotkey guide on cavegen.com (announced in bright purple text in posts above... )
shos
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Thursday, February 2 2017, 7:02 pm EST
~Jack of all trades~

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A good option in the old cavemaker that could be good here too is the option to select mouse, and mark an entire block and ctrl X ctrl V it one row below, etc.

See, you asked me to test your cavegen, you never imagined it would make me make a cave!!
it's about 25% done, and it's mad.



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