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Isa
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Wednesday, August 29 2012, 4:45 pm EST
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'shos' said:
'Isa' said:
'shos' said:
If there's no way to get your hands on the investigation, there really is nothing to be said.

Hm.
..?
I'll rephrase: if the investigation is not public and you do not know the evidence, you cannot say anything about the investigation's result.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Quick

Read about this. A convicted pedophile, drug user and bank robber started to confess murders while he was experiencing closed psychiatric care, handling him drugs as they seemed fit. He confessed up to 30 murders, including ones he wasn't physically able to have done (he confessed one that he would have done while he was 14 year old, at the date of his confirmation) and ones that hadn't actually happened (he confessed to have murdered 2 African boys in Norway, shortly after that, the boys were found in a Swedish suburb). He was obviously lying. The more murders he lied about, the more drugs he got at his psych care. He started lying about his childhood - his parents had, according to him, molested, killed and eaten one of his siblings while he was watching.
The prosecutor bought it all and the defendant quickly accepted his guilt. When he was to show the places where he had left the bodies of some that he had claimed to have killed, he was heavily drugged and couldn't walk on his own. The places he pointed out contained no traces of a body, and when he deemed fit, he changed the story.

He was convicted of eight murders.

He started to retract his confessions - the sole base of the convictions - in 2008 and has now had the charges waived in a few of the 8 cases, while the others are about to be waived.

The investigation was not public, but people could still tell that something was fishy. It's the biggest juridical scandal ever in Sweden.
FlashMarsh
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Wednesday, August 29 2012, 5:07 pm EST

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Shos, everyone notices running over someone, no matter how big your vehicle is. It is fairly obvious that they were trying to kill them. I would have said it might have been an accident if he did it once, but not twice.
shos
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Wednesday, August 29 2012, 5:13 pm EST
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wow
in israel the only juridical scandals are with people who made traffic offenses; for example, you can find some guy who ran over 2 civilians being prosecuted, and well he will get punished, but the point is that he has like, 134134134 prior minor offenses. in real numbers, you can actually find people who had crossed red light 50 times, drove without license 50 times, and stuff like that. The reason we don't have any scandals is that we do not have a jury, and you have to be 100% sure of the guilt to convict.
'FlashMarsh' said:
Shos, everyone notices running over someone, no matter how big your vehicle is. It is fairly obvious that they were trying to kill them. I would have said it might have been an accident if he did it once, but not twice.
aboue the first sentence - you obviously haven't been in a D9. that thing is huge. it can crush a vehicle like a water crate in hatpc, no kidding. it's extremely powerful - it demolishes houses, you know.

about your second sentence - what?? I don't think you get the situation, I'll explain:

it is like when you drive into a parking lot and out of it. you go in(and drive over the person with or without noticing), and then, you realy can't do anything. if the person is under you, he has to get out of there, meaning you need to move. but you can't keep moving forward - a wall is there, you know. so you drive backwards(second time of driving over).  


Isa
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Wednesday, August 29 2012, 5:15 pm EST
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'shos' said:
The reason we don't have any scandals is that we do not have a jury, and you have to be 100% sure of the guilt to convict.


That goes for Sweden too.

And uh...I'll leave the "no scandals" without a comment.
shos
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Wednesday, August 29 2012, 5:18 pm EST
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confession does not count as 100% in israel. if there is no body, for example, there is no murder, even if the person has disappeared 35 years ago(true story, lol).

by no scandals I mean no criminal scandals. nothing related to murders, thieving, suicides, etc.


Isa
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Wednesday, August 29 2012, 5:40 pm EST
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'shos' said:
confession does not count as 100% in israel. if there is no body, for example, there is no murder, even if the person has disappeared 35 years ago(true story, lol).

Usually it's the same here, but the prosecutors found "evidence". A burned piece of bone was used in one case. When analyzed later, that "piece of bone" was in fact from a plank - not even a living being.
jellsprout
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Wednesday, August 29 2012, 6:03 pm EST
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"Former Israeli soldiers disclose routine mistreatment of Palestinian children"
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/aug/26/israeli-soldiers-mistreatment-palestinian-children

Anti-Palastine violence isn't uncommon in Israel. So what would make this particular case different?


Spoiler:
shos
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Wednesday, August 29 2012, 8:50 pm EST
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'Isa' said:
'shos' said:
confession does not count as 100% in israel. if there is no body, for example, there is no murder, even if the person has disappeared 35 years ago(true story, lol).

Usually it's the same here, but the prosecutors found "evidence". A burned piece of bone was used in one case. When analyzed later, that "piece of bone" was in fact from a plank - not even a living being.
lol @ your analyzers XD

'jellsprout' said:
"Former Israeli soldiers disclose routine mistreatment of Palestinian children"
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/aug/26/israeli-soldiers-mistreatment-palestinian-children

Anti-Palastine violence isn't uncommon in Israel. So what would make this particular case different?


I saw that video already; you guys will never understand until you live here, that's the sad truth.
the first story was about a girl who was supposedly beat up while attempting to get to her finals. There are strict rules about people with bags in that place. you do not let them get near you. if one comes in sight, you should in hebrew "stop! stop and identify yourself! stop or I shoot!" if they don't, you shake your gun(lacking english to describe the action. it's sort of intimidation using the gun), and shout it all again in arabic. if they still don't stop walking, you shoot near their legs, and if still, you shoot them. The same goes with every woman in labor, or anyone who looks like they might be carrying anything in that size or larger.
So I don't know what happened to that girl, but it is probably a result of a late-stop, since the Border security will in such a case subdue and arrest you by force.

that's a place which is always dangerous, you just don't know what's going on there to criticize. women pretending to be pregnant holding bombs in their stomach? check. a grandfather pretending to get a heartattack and then boom? check. there's a reason there are so many borders there. stuff you might want to read if you're interested:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_suicide_bombers_in_the_Israeli%E2%80%93Palestinian_conflict

about the second one - bummer, but well, if you listen to what he describes, I see nothing wrong in that doing. in the same manner there was a kid there, it could be a man with a gun =\

~~~
so what would make this different? that activist wasn't palastinian, so that's irrelevant even if true, lol. Each and every reported case about soldier violence gets to court here, you just don't know that. You only know about the bad things here becuase that's what the media likes to show =(


Thomas
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Thursday, August 30 2012, 9:26 pm EST
the clique shall prevail

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Has the president of Iran heard this song?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLQJ4toj-JY
Isa
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Friday, August 31 2012, 8:15 am EST
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Oh, Clint Eastwood, you so old.
FlashMarsh
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Tuesday, September 4 2012, 9:04 am EST

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Quote:
The United States has indirectly informed Iran, via two European nations, that it would not back an Israeli strike against the country's nuclear facilities, as long as Tehran refrains from attacking American interests in the Persian Gulf, Yedioth Ahronoth reported Monday.

According to the report, Washington used covert back-channels in Europe to clarify that the US does not intend to back Israel in a strike that may spark a regional conflict.

In return, Washington reportedly expects Iran to steer clear of strategic American assets in the Persian Gulf, such as military bases and aircraft carriers.

Israeli officials reported an unprecedented low in the two nations' defense ties, which stems from the Obama administration's desire to warn Israel against mounting an uncoordinated attack on Iran.

The New York Times reported Monday that US President Barack Obama is promoting a series of steps meant to curb an Israeli offensive against Iran, while forcing the Islamic Republic to take the nuclear negotiations more seriously.

One of the steps considered is "an official declaration by Obama about what might bring about American military action, as well as covert activities that have been previously considered and rejected," the report said.

Several of Obama's top advisors believe that Jerusalem is seeking an unequivocal American statement regarding a US strike on Iran – should it actively pursue a nuclear bomb.

Israel hopes such a statement is made during Obama's address before the UN General Assembly on September 25.

Others in the White House said Israel is trying to drag the US into an unnecessary conflict in the Gulf.

White House spokesman Jay Carney said Monday that "There is absolutely no daylight between the United States and Israel when it comes to preventing Iran from getting a nuclear weapon."

Carney said that all options remain on the table for Iran. He said the "window for diplomacy remains open," adding that the diplomatic process remains the best way to deal with the Islamic Republic, though "that window will not remain open indefinitely."

Cyber war a go?

According to the New York Times, Washington has also sent Iran a back-channel deal suggesting they curb their nuclear ambitions, but Tehran rejected the deal, saying no agreement is possible sans lifting all West-imposed sanctions.

According to the report, the Obama administration is exploring the possibility of mounting a covert operation, as well as waging a "quiet" cyber war against Iran.

President Obama had previously rejected the notion, fearing such cyber assaults would wreak havoc on Iranian civilian life.

Later in September, the United States and more than 25 other nations will hold the largest-ever minesweeping exercise in the Persian Gulf, in what military officials say is a demonstration of unity and a defensive step to prevent Iran from attempting to block oil exports through the Strait of Hormuz.

In fact, the United States and Iran have each announced what amounted to dueling defensive exercises to be conducted this fall, each intended to dissuade the other from attack.


Source
shos
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Tuesday, September 4 2012, 9:16 am EST
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This source is the main newspaper in Israel - and the biggest news site, of course. I have read this in the newspaper yesterday. I'm all for a cyber-war attitude in this thing; although I do support our PM's idea - that if Obama states a limit which-if-will-be-broken the US will attack, then Israel has no reason to start an attack there.


Darvince
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Wednesday, September 12 2012, 1:51 am EST
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"Time is a circuit, not a line; cybernetics instantiates templexity."

shos
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Wednesday, September 12 2012, 6:47 am EST
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lol, wierd O_o

good that you brought this topic up, I wanted to post here yesterday and forgot. Soo yesterday I went to my sister's home in the south to help her move. on the way there there was an alarm. my first time.

so we stopped the car in the middle of the road, exited it, and all started running like maniacs to wherever the locals run to, lol. apparantly most of the houses there don't have a shelter, so we stood in the staircase room with all the residents of the building, buttom floor of course. we were like 20 people in the area of a small elevator, hehe. mom obviously started crying and nearly choked me holding me close, lol. I stayed cool cuz I don't get nervous easily, but well, that was quite an experience indeed. we heard two booms, one strong and one weak. as the locals told us, we stayed there for five minutes after the alarm and then went out and back into the car.

worst thing was this - the news later said that it was a false alarm. This means that it wasn't. usually when rockets are shot at us they don't really aim cuz they don't really care where it hits, and so, it usually doesn't kill people. either way, in the news and media they never say where the rockets fell, so that the shooters can't aim better next time. if they said that it was false alarm, despite the fact that I heard two booms, it means that something was directly hit, I guess. probably not killed anyone - because we see on the news every single non-natural death in the country - but I assume it hit some important building or something. who knows.

so yeah, just letting it out. running for shelter is scary as hell. don't crap your pants.

edit: the newspaper says there were 4 alarms yesterday; three missiles for the first three, and nobody knows what caused the last alarm. So uh. yeah. I dunno which alarm that was =|


jellsprout
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Wednesday, September 12 2012, 8:34 am EST
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Election day.


Spoiler:
snipereborn
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Wednesday, September 12 2012, 3:34 pm EST
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'Darvince' said:

lol. I don't like the chipping idea, but reactions to it are way overboard, and sometimes flat out untrue. "RFID can be tracked by anyone from anywhere!!!" Um, no, RFID has a very short range. In order for someone to track you, they have to physically follow you around and their scanner would only work if you carried the card around with you everywhere outside of school. The only reason it would work in a school is because they would have a giant lattice of RFID receivers all over the building. Also, the privacy impact outside of the school building would be non-existent. The chips would just have a generic student ID number being broadcast, which means nothing unless someone then hacks into the schools computers to translate the student ID into a name. What's more, you could easily encrypt the broadcast number, and then have the number be different from the record computers' internal student ID, thereby giving a layer of encryption on top of a layer of indirection (and this can of course be repeated arbitrarily, but once is more than enough).
With all that acknowledged, the reason I don't like the chipping idea is because it's pointless. I can defeat the tracker with incredible easy. If I want to be hidden, I just put my card in a Faraday cage (like those aluminium wallet things). If I want to skip class but look like I was in it, I give my card to a friend, who keeps it in their pocket or purse. Tada! Setting up the whole system is a ridiculous waste of money because, let's face it, teenagers know more about technology than the school IT department.


Everyone runs faster with a knife.
FlashMarsh
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Wednesday, September 12 2012, 4:22 pm EST

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You don't dislike it because it treats people like like they've automatically done something wrong, and that they are at least attempting to track you? It doesn't matter to me that it obviously won't work, because over time it will be refined and the intentions are the same regardless. I'd be surprised if this wasn't taken to court (and the state would definitely lose).
snipereborn
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Wednesday, September 12 2012, 6:58 pm EST
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It doesn't treat people like they've automatically done something wrong. When something wrong does happen, it lets them tell who did it and can be used to decide an argument (i.e. I say I was there but the teacher says I wasn't. "Let's check the system. Yep, he was there." Or "Nope, you get detention.".) It's just like registering a firearm or getting fingerprinted for a secure job. As far as I'm concerned, if you want a free public education for your kids, then you have to agree that they must follow the school's rules, otherwise you can home-school them or pay to send them to a private school.
I would also like to point out that if you have ever used the internet or bought anything, ever, then someone is always trying to track you. Being tracked is only bad if the person doing the tracking intends you ill. Plus, the tracking that the school would do is so limited as to be useless for much of anything. If they could track you all the time (like with a satellite), that's bad and creepy, but that isn't the case. The school can only track you while you're in their building and carrying your card. If they can give out ID cards at all, then I don't see why they can't do this. It's their card, they can do whatever they want with it. However, since the public school system is run on my money, I say they shouldn't do it because it's stupid.
If you really think the state would definitely lose, I suggest you remember that conservatives arn't in power in the US courts, so it is more likely than not that the school system would get a sympathetic judge. After all, the USSC just ruled that adults can be forced to pay for something they don't want.


Everyone runs faster with a knife.
shos
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Wednesday, September 12 2012, 7:23 pm EST
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hmph nobody commented on my super exciting and full of fear story of the alarm yes, I realize I didn't comment on that other thing too..


Isa
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Wednesday, September 12 2012, 7:38 pm EST
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'jellsprout' said:
Election day.

Hooray for the poor results that Wilders got!
snipereborn
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Thursday, September 13 2012, 1:25 am EST
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Lol, sorry shos. Didn't have much to say. My prayers are always with Israel. Try not to get es'ploded.


Everyone runs faster with a knife.
Isa
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Thursday, September 13 2012, 5:11 am EST
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Romney sure shows true leadership skills when he says Obama supports the killings of US ambassadors.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/09/a-timeline-of-the-attacks-in-libya-and-egypt----and-the-responses.php?ref=fpb
shos
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Thursday, September 13 2012, 6:48 am EST
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lol. I'm not really sure which one I want to win, you know. Obama's contact with israel is the worst it's ever been perhaps, but romney is...well.. >__>


Isa
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Thursday, September 13 2012, 7:29 am EST
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Romney has declared Russia as the biggest foe of USA too. I wouldn't let that guy touch foreign politics with a ten feet long pole.
jellsprout
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Thursday, September 13 2012, 7:35 am EST
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Elections went well. There have been major victories for left Labour and the right Liberals, with a minor victory for the centrist Democrats. The Christian Moderates have heavy losses, as well as the Populists and the Greens. The Socialists, both Christian Conservatives parties and Animal Rights party stayed roughly the same and a party for the elderly is new in the House of Commons with two seats.
Most surprising is that the victories for Labour and the Liberals is so huge that for the first time in forever we can form a coalition with only two parties. They will probably need support from the Democrats or Moderates for the Parlement, but this shouldn't be too troublesome.
I am satisfied with the elections and my faith in the Dutch population has increased.


Spoiler:

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